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This was the hardest RV secret I’ve ever had to keep…
Just last week, Winnebago finally released their Revel 4×4. The Revel is the production version of the 4×4 Adventure Vehicle that they showed at last year’s Outdoor Retailer show. At that show, we made a video with Chris Bienert, who is the designer behind the Revel. That video turned out to be quite popular, and our page with that video had become the de-facto message board for rumors, hints, knowledge, and product suggestions for the coach.
Well this summer, when we were at the Winnebago Grand National Rally, we got a chance to shoot another review with Chris on the ready-to-be-released Winnebago Revel. But we couldn’t release the video!! It was killing me!! Now that they’ve officially launched (and started selling) the Revel, we’re free to show you this review.
We filmed this walkthrough in the factory, in part of the building that’s like their “skunk works”. There were concepts for other vehicles sitting about, and we had to be careful not to get too much of them on camera. I believe they’ve all been released now, so I’m not too concerned if we messed up. Again we had Chris, and he and I went over the whole vehicle from head to toe, inside and out. It was great to have the rig’s designer there to ask questions of, and we think it makes for an interesting review. (Also, it was insanely hot inside the building, so if you see us sweating, you know why.)
One thing we didn’t mention in the video: spare tire. Some of you have asked about it, and it DOES have one; here it is:
We’ve seen the Revel since we filmed this (at the Elkhart launch) but we have not had the chance to take one out for a spin ourselves yet. You all know that I’m a winter camping mod kind of lunatic, so I’m particularly interested in testing out the winter camping capabilities of the rig. With any luck, once the weather turns cold, we’ll be able to take one to Montana skiing or something.
Until then, enjoy the video!
The Revel is a trailblazer for people who want a smaller RV capable of hauling motor bikes, four by’s and upright bikes. But a scaled down non 4-wheel drive version with storage in the back for hauling two or more FOLDING RECUMBENT TRIKES is the quickly emerging market niche aching to be addressed.
Sprinter axle, tranny are not typically sealed so forget about any aggressive water crossing. Looks nice but useless if you are in wet areas off road. My Roadtrek CS Adventurous 3500 4×4 had this among 100 other issues for a new RV. Never buying a new RV again. Warranty is useless when stuck. Good luck.
Too bad there isn’t a way to run the fan function on the A/C that can run off the solar/batteries. Would love to have two fans but also have the A/C for the heat in the southwest.
The DC system is what is really charged by the batteries. So the fans running on 12v is actually a good thing, because they don’t need to go through the inverter.
Two fans PLUS AC would be difficult on the Revel. The problem isn’t the power so much as the roof space!
An FYI:
From the website Arfc.org, “Winnebago Industries, Inc (Winnebago) is recalling certain 2018-2019 Winnebago Revel vehicles. The roof luggage rack mounting brackets on these vehicles may crack, allowing the luggage rack to detach from the roof of the vehicle. If the luggage rack detaches from the roof while driving, it can increase the risk of a crash. Winnebago will replace the mounting brackets, along with an additional metal L bracket to assist in securing the cross members to the luggage rack rails, free of charge. The recall is expected to begin on April 25, 2018. Owners may contact Winnebago customer service at 1-800-537-1885”
Winnebago has a terrible warranty on the engine transmission and chasie at only 12 months? For such an expensive vehicle that is unacceptable
Winnebago doesn’t warranty the engine and chassis. On the Revel, that warranty coverage is from Mercedes, and it is much longer than 12 months.
HI JUDY, YOUR WARRANTY THRU WINNABEGO IS 12 MONTHS ON THE COACH AND ALL YOUR APPLIANCES, ON YOUR CHASSIS YOU HAVE 5 YEARS OR 100,000 MILES WHICH EVER COMES FIRST THRU MERCEDES.I HOPE THIS WAS HELPFUL AND HAVE A WONDERFUL DAY.
Besides a price increase, are there any changes for the 2019 Revel? Thanks!
Hi!
Do you know if Winnebago will add the Volta Pure3 battery system (or something similar) to the Revel? Are there any reasons, besides cost, to avoid it? Are there any advantages to the current AGM setup? Thanks!
P.S. As a first time prospective RV buyer, I’ve learned a lot from your website. It’s entertaining, too.
Glad you’re finding our site useful!
I honestly don’t know if Winnebago is considering adding this to the Revel or not. Personally, I wonder if they have the space to spare underneath the van. (The Revel is on the shorter Sprinter.)
There are a lot of advantages to the Lithium system, and I can’t think of any disadvantages after living with one for coming up on two years now.
I did a bit of research and it seems like even the automotive lithium batteries used by Volta need to be above a certain temperature in order to charge. Apparently, however, these batteries can be used in colder temperatures. If correct, then the Volta system would have limitations as a true four season solution for which the Revel has been designed with the AGM batteries.
Does this make sense?
Here’s the source of my “research”:
http://www.classbforum.com/forums/f5/winnebago-travato-thread-here-3579-67.html
I do believe that once you got the rig up to temperature, the Volta system would be just fine for wintertime camping.
Todd makes sense. Lithium batteries will not charge in cold weather. Wikipedia: Li‑ion batteries offer good charging performance at cooler temperatures and may even allow ‘fast-charging’ within a temperature range of 5 to 45 °C (41 to 113 °F). Charging should be performed within this temperature range. At temperatures from 0 to 5 °C charging is possible, but the charge current should be reduced.
I hear this kind of thing all the time…
But only from people who don’t own lithium rigs, RV sales people selling old-tech rigs, and other manufacturers who don’t offer lithium rigs who want to trash talk it.
Any problems with charging a lithium battery in the cold can be easily overcome by keeping the battery inside or heating it with heating pads. My mother could do it. It’s THAT easy.
Here’s a video where we’re camping in our rig below zero. Of all the things we thought about on this trip, our lithium battery system was not one of them. Our Top 9 Winter RVing Tips
Why only 17 inch wheels and tires on a one ton. Toyota RAV Four has 19 inch tires. Most trucks come with 20 inch tires 17 inch tires are to small for this RV this should have 19 inch tires.
I suspect Winnebago is constrained by Mercedes as to what they can do with a new chassis and not impact warranty.
This is a good question (assuming you desire two or three more inches of outer TIRE diameter, rather than just RIM diameter) because taller tires tend to be better for off-road driving when it comes to surmounting obstacles.
What the glossy sales literature for cars often erroneously labels as “wheel” size is actually the rim diameter, i.e. the inner diameter of the tire in inches, which shows up on the tire wall in the standard label code as the third number. In a good light truck (LT) tire, you usually see this number right after the “R” which stands for “radial,” indicating the tire’s construction type.
Mercedes-Benz has been making modern Sprinters with 16-inch rims and equipping the 2500 models with LT 245/75 R 16 tires. It certainly is tempting to consider putting taller wheels on a 4×4 Sprinter. Its chassis has been elevated by about 6 inches compared to the base 2WD models. That makes the wheels (i.e. the rims mated with the standard tires) appear smaller than they really are. However, the Sprinter’s wheel wells have not been enlarged. More space is available only at the top, not in front and behind the tires. We must maintain sufficient clearance around the tires to accommodate additional suspension movements to be expected from an off-road vehicle. Most importantly, of course, is the space requirement of the turning front wheels.
If you’ve ever worked on a Sprinter, you know how cramped space is in the engine bay, particularly since the addition of the Blue Tec components. In an ORV, you definitely don’t want to sacrifice much on turn radius! And, with the increased probability of mud building up in the wheel wells, you’d rather have more than less space available for that and to make it easier to clear that out when it happens.
Compared to other vans, the Sprinter’s width is rather narrow, which actually provides MB an important competitive advantage in many markets, and incidentally allows the Sprinter to pass through built-up as well as natural areas off the beaten track that wider vehicles simply cannot traverse.
But, particularly with the high-roof versions of the Sprinter, the remarkable height to width ratio can be challenging in high crosswinds and on cornering at highway speeds. Mercedes-Benz has been admirably — indeed almost incredibly — successful at minimizing the effects of this handicap with the Sprinter’s highly sophisticated electronic stability control, traction control, brake assist, brake-force distribution, anti-block break, and automatic gear-shifting systems.
These systems have been optimized and tuned over years of meticulous engineering and on-the-road performance analysis efforts. Of critical importance among a slew of sensors in the engine and the powertrain that continuously feed a massive stream of data to those systems, are the sensors that report the rotational speed and millisecond changes of acceleration or deceleration of each individual wheel.
If you change the size of the wheels, the subtle balances and controls that keep these systems working together rather than against each other will be upset. That will not only affect the vehicle’s smooth handling but inevitably its excellent fuel mileage and its pollution control systems, too. Likely, it would even render it dangerous to drive.
In my youth, many guys would spend lots of time tinkering with their vehicles to tune them for greater performance, or even upgrade them with an engine from another manufacturer. You cannot do that anymore. Any tampering with a Sprinter will likely end in great disappointment, if not worse, because one can’t adjust the proprietary software. These considerations apply to some degree to most other modern performance cars.
When you hear about options for larger rims, it usually means that increased rim size has to be balanced by reducing the height of the tire sidewall, so that the actual wheel height will not change very much. Most people do that just for looks because the lower-profile tires with larger rims have a greater resemblance to those used in racing cars. If using the same brand and series of tires or very similar ones, the lower profile tire option may provide somewhat sportier handling with a more direct steering feel, but not as smooth a ride and more noticeable impacts and vibrations from bumps and unevenness in the road surface.
In fact, Winnebago has chosen to use the BF Goodrich® T/A® KO2 LT245/70R17 tires for the Revel. Notice, that this means a 17-inch rim, but that the sidewall of the tire is only 70 percent as tall as the tire is wide. On the standard Sprinter tire LT245/75R16 that ratio is 75 percent. Therefore, the wheel height, or outer radius of the new tire, is only 0.04 inches greater than in the OEM tire. Thus the impact on the electronic systems is minimal, and I am sure that Winnebago consulted with MB engineering before deciding on that switch. Typically the OEM tires are low cost and have poor durability. The T/A KO2 tire is an entirely different beast. Its highly advanced engineering provides not only high performance but also great robustness off-road as well as comfort on the highway.
The 4×4 Sprinters offer an outstanding compromise between off-road capabilities and acceptable handling and ease at Interstate speeds if driven by a responsible driver. Many alternatives favor one or the other of these aspects, but we have little choice among vans that are suitable for a B class RV.
There’s an excellent Facebook page specifically for the Revel: https://www.facebook.com/groups/winnebago4x4/
Yes, there is that one, which is older and for-profit.
There’s also a new group, run **by actual owners**. You can find it here:
https://www.facebook.com/groups/revelowners
If you haven’t joined that one yet, give it a look.
I’ve been a member of that group for several months and a bit puzzled by your statement that’s it’s “for-profit.” Maybe you know something I don’t, such as who profits? Regardless, thanks for the heads-up on the other FB group; I’ll check it out.
Well, the group owner, actually. He had agreed to accept money directly from a dealership as a sponsorship. In his defense, it’s his prerogative as the owner to accept cash and sponsorships, and he was transparent about it, so it’s all on the up and up. Although he has since taken down the banner ads for the dealership, it is unclear whether the sponsorship payments still continue. I’m sure it’s a great group, and he seems like a nice guy, but I just like the impartiality and sincerity of the “Revel Owners and Wannabes” group. Even the moderators of the Revel Owners and Wannabes group are all owners.
OK, now I see it’s the Revel dealers in the group trying to sell a Revel. Got it.
What is the bolt pattern on the wheel.? 6-135?
James and Stef,
Hello, thanks for this great review. One thing I was curious about was how much weight can the Revel carry? I was looking for the OCCC on the website without much success. if not, maybe if you know the curb weight? If you know or find out one day, can you post it here? Much appreciated, thank you for this great website and videos, wannabe RV’er like me are in your debt!
Good question! We’ll be seeing a Revel in Florida later this month. I’ll grab the details if I remember.
My suspicion is that the Cargo Carrying Capacity is pretty high. The Sprinter has a generally high GVWR for the vans (though I don’t know specifically about the single rear wheel 4WD variant), and building a van is a lot less “weighty” than a class C. So I expect it to be over a thousand pounds. But we’ll see.
HI JAMES AND STEF, CHECK YOUR VIN PLATE ON THE DRIVER DOOR SILL, ALL WEIGHTS AND MEASURES WILL BE LOCATED THERE, HAVE A TERRIFIC DAY
Thank you so much for the vids and posts. I like watching people who know what they are talking about and aren’t just trying to make a sale doing the walk around reviews. Have a question I can’t find an answer to, why are class b’s so expensive? Winnebago should be able to save about $11K buying a cab chassis over a cargo van (MB example). But then they have to build an entire house structure, add more cabinets and storage, longer bodies so longer wiring and plumbing runs and end up with a class c that lists for less than the b. Are they able to built the coach house that cheaply or is this just a case of the b market being okay with paying more?
It actually is cheaper to build a class C than a class B. In a class C, the walls are added *last*. Much easier and faster to do, and it works well on a line. In a class B, everything comes in through the doors, and nothing is straight or square. Much slower and more costly.
Man, really wished they kept the old design on the bed. I required a stand up cargo area when bed not in use. The new 5′ height with the bed all the way up is too low for me at 6′
Hope they go back to a simple platform bed, or make a quick disconnect or something for the next gen as it looks like it rolls up into the platform of the bed. I imagine it would drop the price quite a bit too.
Does it look like 4 adults would travel comfortably and safely in this vehicle? I see 4 seat belts, but is it comfortable. Looks like you can sleep 2 on the bed, 1 under the bed on the floor, and one in the galley/door way.
Thanks, so lucky you got to see this.
As you point out, there are 4 seat belts. So traveling safely isn’t a problem.
The drop down bed could hold 2. One could sleep on the second bed thing in the dinette, and one could, as you suggest, sleep on the floor with a sleeping bag or whatever.
I think it would work. At least for a limited time, like a long weekend or something.
I don’t think 4 adults full-timing is the use-case Winnebago was shooting for when they designed this though.
I’m imagining my 2 teenagers sitting next to each other on the kitchen bench on a multiple hour road trip and I don’t see anything good happening….hahaha…..yeah I was thinking a long weekend or a trip that was mixed with overnight in the Revel and hotel use.
Hi James & Stef,
I just want to start out and say how much I have learned about RVing and Class B’s from your vids and posts. FIST BUMP!
I really am interested in the Revel and just had a few questions that I ca’tn get answers to. I thought perhaps you have an inside track to help out.
1. What is the weight limit of the ladder? Is it aluminum? and are those plastic tips at the top that grab onto the roof rack? YIKES!
2. What is the weight limit of the bed when down? I have 3 numbers, so that’s no help?
3. How much space is there under the mattress, I mean under the slats? Room to hide things?
Let me say thanks in advance if you are able to answer these questions for me and I am sure for others as well.
THANKS!
I can ask about the first two, as I haven’t investigated that.
On the third question. There’s perhaps 2-3″ underneath the slats. You could hide narrow things. Folded up sheets. Magazines. A T-shirt or two. Maybe a closed up laptop.
Hello, thank you for your videos, I have enjoyed watching them as I explore my options for getting my first RV. I love this one! Do you know if the side and rear door bug screens that are available in the other Winnebago Class B vans are are available in this one?
Apologies in advance if this question was answered already – I did read through the questions to make sure but may have missed it. 🙂 Thanks again for all you do!
We didn’t see any factory supplied door screens on the units we’ve seen.
However, the Revel is built on a Sprinter chassis and there are tons of aftermarket screen options for them.
Ours came with nice door screens for both the side and back doors. Look like they will fit and work very well, tho we haven’t had it out in warm weather yet.
Great review James, thank you. This is the perfect 4×4 RV for traversing muddy farm roads during duck season with waders, a dog box, coolers and loads of other hunting gear in the rear garage! It’s also ideal for hitting the local Calif. beaches when surf fishing! I’ve been searching for a practical size RV that’s as comfortable on a snowy mountain pass as it is parking on the streets of San Francisco…
Sounds like you’re one of the ones they designed it for!
Great reviews, thank you!
Do you think they’ll offer a black tank option?
Thank you for this great and thorough review! I love your site! A few questions: a) we would like to be able to tow our Seadoo. Do you think there would be any issue with the bottom back of the Revel going in the water at a boat ramp? As we are also looking at the Travato, a couple of questions: b) same question – could we tow a Seadoo and would there be any issue with the bottom back of the Travato going in the water at a boat ramp (some can be steep)? c) does the Travato come in 4×4? I don’t think so but wanted to confirm. I know the Era does but we like the ruggedness/adventure-centric nature of the Travato more. If it does not, is there any hope Winnebago will offer this soon? Would be great for winter sports! Thanks so much for your help!
I can reply to this one Jim.
Getting the back wet won’t hurt anything BUT, the best thing to do if you use this setup often would be to extend the front of the seadoo trailer. I have a 10 ft drag boat that I extended the neck on so that it’s about 6 feet from tow ball to front of boat and put a walk platform 8 inches wide on it.
This makes the trailer
1- ride better
2-makes launching completely dry for driver and tow vehicle
3- makes seeing the trailer when turning possible, AND makes backing it in easier(cause it jack-knifes more slowly)
4- it may even allow you to see seadoo in your stock mirrors while driving(although on my class A I still couldn’t see it).
We’re rolling with a super short single axle trailer now, and I kinda wish it was a bit longer. It jack-knifes if I look at it funny…
I am concerned about all the service issues that the bluetec diesel engine is experiencing ? What are your thoughts ?
Personally, I wouldn’t be too concerned.
If you spend enough time on forums, you realize that the people posting are usually just those with problems. The thousands of people who have things go right never bother to complain.
Does the Revel have built in shades for the rear door windows!?!? What about for the front windows!?!? Other cheaper Winnebago sprinters have them and for 135K$ shouldn’t the revel? How is this issue best addressed? Thanks!
Yes, there are shades for the windows in the Revel. They either snap or magnet on, I don’t remember.
Just didn’t show them because there was so much else to talk to Chris about. But they’re there!
James, thanks for the thorough review! Super excited about the Revel. At the end of the video you state that the Revel has “plenty of ground clearance.” Did Chris mention actual numbers? Is there about 10″ of ground clearance?
We didn’t discuss actual numbers. I could guess, but I don’t have any real information.
The Revel was at the Pomona RV show this weekend, but I did not have a measuring tape. Perhaps one of the show goers will chime in (if they had a tape).
In any case, it did not look like Winnebago had done anything to decrease the clearance on the chassis itself. So perhaps Mercedes Benz has some specifications.
James, How often have you found the lack of ground clearance to be a problem in Lance?
Well, never actually.
Although, there may have been some other roads we might have taken were we in a 4 wheel drive vehicle.
Thank you for the review. Do you think the Advanced RV permanent leveling jacks would work on the Revel? Is it possible for the table to unclip from the galley and reclip outside the van onto some type of rail? It would be nice to be able to close the van door (keeping the mosquitoes out) and still use the table for things like holding your solar stove while you cook.
I believe the E&P leveling jacks would fit on the Revel – but Advanced RV or another installer would have the final word on that.
The rear mounting points should be clear as there is just a spare tire back there – no tanks or generator. The front mounting points should be clear as well.
As far as detaching and reattaching the table – that’s not a current option. I’m sure you could hack that up yourself though. Who knows – maybe you do it and then it finds its way into a future revision of the Revel!
Thanks for your time. I appreciate it.
James, do you know what happened to the bike rack in the concept video? I remember you commenting on it. I’m surprised it’s not an option (or is it?). Thanks!
Winnebago uses it on other models. I’m sure you could get one and have it installed. It fits with the ladder.
I asked my local RV dealer about the bike rack on the Revel. The reply was:
Heard back from Winnebago today about a bike rack. The bike rack they offer on their other class B’s will not fit on the Revel. They said there’s a hitch so an aftermarket one could be installed.
Interesting. And… Bummer!
Overland Explorer Expedition Vehicles is manufacturing some super nice Sprinters. It is worth giving them a look.
http://www.overlandex.com
James- not to take away from the great Revel video here, but I am eager to hear your thoughts on the Advanced RV High voltage lithium Volta Power System. Please do a review asap! Hi Step!
Well, for me to do a review, I’d have to have one of their coaches to use for a couple of weeks!
Last I heard, Advanced RV was still selling everything they could make as fast as they could make it, so a loaner coach isn’t super likely any time soon, unfortunately.
But if I get the opportunity, yes, I’ll do it.
Thank you for an outstanding walk through. While the lack of lithium and presence of cassette toilet gives me a pause, it’s just about perfect. I think that rear view camera is great! They need to emphasize that on their brochure/website.
I’m wondering why they didn’t place a window on the aft starboard side, but they must’ve had their reasons. While my current military service precludes me from having any kind of RV lifestyle, it’ll be within my reach in 5 years or so. Hopefully they’ll have their lithium issues sorted out. Your website and YouTube videos are superb.
Hi NavyDoc – My guess is that there is no window on the aft starboard side because the sliding door would rip it off if it were open when the door was opened.
Hang in there – 5 years will be here before you know it. Hope to see you out on the open road some day!
The Aktiv 1.0 has the same type windows including one on the aft starboard side. Yes it can be crushed, if open, by the slider. But I believe they now put a stop or detente in the slider track to prevent this. Winnebago could do this especially since a large portion of the slider opening is not usable due to the galley placement. But (again) it might just be too tight with the bump out.
Just saw one for sale at RVTrader for under $107K. Quite a discount:
https://www.rvtrader.com/dealers/Lewis-RV-Sales-734958/listing/2018-Winnebago-Revel-44E-5000288808
Hi James,
Do you know what brand/model of acrylic window is on the Revel? Short of buying a new Revel, I’d be interested in a retrofit for my 59G.
I don’t know for sure which brand they are using on the Revel. But I know Dometic (distributor for Seitz) and Plastoform both make those kinds of windows and you can get them over here if you try really hard.
Could you switch out the lead batteries for Li? could they be charged from the existing alternator or would you still need another, dedicated one?
Wait. I thought I just answered this one? Here’s what I said.
Yes, you could switch the AGM batteries for lithium. And yes, the vehicle alternator would charge them the same as it does currently.
BUT. Those batteries are outside the heated space. They would potentially freeze, and lithium batteries do not like to freeze. Also, without changing the charging profile on the inverter, the alternator, and the solar charge controller, you would be charging the lithium batteries sub-optimally.
In other words, you could do it, but it would be tough on the batteries.
Thanks!
Good news from Relion. Their RB100-LT can be charged at temps as low as -4F. Build a closed cell foam enclosure, add a small heating pad and you can go way lower. So 150 a/h usable with the OEM AGM’s or sub out for Relion lithiums and have a usable 255 a/h (drawing the lithiums down to 15%). Of course you pay dearly for this ability at around $1300/battery.
The doubling of the usable amp-hours could easily power two or three small heating pads all night long.
If I were this serious about cold weather camping, e.g. below 10F for many days, I’d even go so far as to cut vent holes from the heated interior into the insulated batter box below holding the Relions and put a small fan to work moving warm air into the box.
Jame, I have two questions that you may not be able to answer unless you take another look at the RV:
1. The refrigerator seems rather small. Can you fit a standard 1/2 gallon of milk in it?
2. The video mentioned a new antenna for the GPS system. Would there be any way to hook a cellular booster into the same antenna? Or maybe a separate antenna in the same area (since there’s already a hole in the roof for the GPS antenna)?
Thanks!
I think I can answer them.
1. The refrigerator is short, yes. But it is a Nova Kool. We have a Nova Kool, and they typically provide a shelf that has an opening in it so that a half gallon of milk will fit. I haven’t verified this fridge personally, but I’d be willing to bet they have the same split/opening shelf.
2. I doubt that you could use the GPS antenna for a cell booster. Different antennae design, frequencies, etc. You might be able to use the same opening for a second wire, but that would actually be more difficult than just making your own and sealing it properly.
Great discussion here, thanks for the review. There is so much good work here. I would bet that the actual retail prices will come down. The compromises here are for a crowd that is pretty picky and there are some interesting custom options out there that would end up being a little less-not everyone has to get a Sportsmobile… With two max fans in a van this size you can do a lot to cool things down, but for those times when you are on the road getting somewhere and want to have a lunch and you are worried about your dog and there is no AC… But, then again, when we take our dogs we make compromises and just do not leave them alone in the van alone for more than 15 minutes. I love not worrying about a generator or propane. A mini EarthRoamer 🙂 I really appreciate the emphasis on insulation being in the NE and the cassette toilet is key. Northstar truck campers are the only brand that features them, really helps for cold weather camping, but I prefer the van because we deal with less than ideal weather quite often and getting from driving to toilet to bed without going out on a rainy night can be very nice. I had a 4×4 96 Econoline 350 Airstream van, loved my big awning, but actually prefer the manual with the supportive legs! Still, nice work Winnebago. Top of my list, started a new savings account yesterday…
Hi James ! I am on my 2nd Travato .. and of course, love it. But having spent time in a Sprinter conversion .. cycling, windsurfing Hood River etc.. some 5yrs ago.. I would like to hear YOUR opinion as to going back to a sprinter… they are NOT inexpensive B’s … right ? Thanks ! Say hey to Stef !
We certainly prefer the way the ProMaster drives. But the ProMaster can’t go where this one can.
Honestly, as far as the chassis goes, either one will work. It all depends on what you want to do with the van.
An interesting RV for sure. I was somewhat confused on the whole restroom deal. To take a proper shower in that space would be a challenge but standing outside taking one might work if the temps aren’t to extreme. I like the idea of operating the generator on the same fuel as the prime mover.
Well, in this rig, there is no generator. (Unless you bring one.)
I have confused the drivers side exhaust pipe as being connected to a diesel fired generator instead of the heating system.
Ahhh.. That makes sense now.
I’ve been waiting a year for this! I am currently on a 1 year trip across the country to see all of the National Parks, and got too impatient for this RV to become available…so I took off in my SUV. Now I REALLY want one! Maybe WInnebago wants an amazing 1 year long, publicized road test?
This would be a great vehicle for visiting the (back roads of the) national parks.
I liked the bed, but if each corner could be raised or lowered separately then on un-level ground one can level the bed instead of the RV.
They had originally had something like that in the concept vehicle, but didn’t go that way for production. I don’t know their reasons…
James (and Stefany!), thanks for such comprehensive information about the Revel! James, you weren’t kidding about holding in that massive secret especially running around the fields of Iowa this summer with your merry band of Travatoans! I’d also like to say thanks for the massive education that I have received by reading through your blogs, watching your videos, and face to face conversations. (May all of that continue! 😉 From a never-owned-an-RV-yet-but-about-to-pull-the-trigger kind of person, I’d like to hear your input on the Revel as an entry vehicle into RVing. Thanks!
Well, it would be a fine first RV if you’re looking for a gear hauler to go rock climbing or surfing for epic long weekends and shorter trips. But if you want something like a drawer to store your socks in while you cross the country on paved roads for a month, this might not be the best first RV for you.
In short, I don’t think there’s anything about the Revel that make it a better or worse “first” RV – it all comes down to how you want to use it.
In 2017, for me, being all electric but failing to run the AC off of the interter is an epic fail. One of my basic requirements in an RV is to be a safe and comfortable place to leave the dogs when I am somewhere they can’t go. To be so close, but not run AC or even have a lithium option takes a whole lot of great engineering and design effort and throws it into a sub-optimally treated cassette toilet. Makes me sad.
Well, it’s true that you won’t be running the air conditioner off the inverter. So if the dog thing is a deal breaker for you, I get it.
But everything else in the coach that isn’t an air conditioner should run just fine for days off the setup as is.
I do agree that a lithium/2nd alternator solution would be an awesome addition to this vehicle. And who knows, we may see it in a future edition of the Revel!
Could you switch the lead batteries for Li? could they be charged from the existing alternator or would you still need another, dedicated one?
Yes, you could switch the AGM batteries for lithium. And yes, the vehicle alternator would charge them the same as it does currently.
BUT. Those batteries are outside the heated space. They would potentially freeze, and lithium batteries do not like to freeze. Also, without changing the charging profile on the inverter, the alternator, and the solar charge controller, you would be charging the lithium batteries sub-optimally.
In other words, you could do it, but it would be tough on the batteries.
A hitch platform that you can buy for cheap at any harbor freight store and a cheap generator w a sun cover(and an electric fan blowing on if you’re gonna be in REALLY hot areas) will run for 5- to 10 hours for very little fuel and a bigger tank can be added if you set up generator with the cover and a fan. So when talking about camper for 100 grand, a 500-1000.oo generator, 30 dollar fan, an extension cord and a gas can don’t seem like much of a cost increase. Lol and by having them out back they don’t reduce ground clearance or wheel base.
Yeah, but I think most people who would buy this rig wouldn’t be interested in running a generator. At least that was the feedback that was given on the prototype. That’s why the AC is just an option and there’s no generator on board.
Different crowd from the regular RV set, for sure!
Perhaps a ventilated (and fireproof) gear box on a swing arm mounted on the back hitch with a portable generator and some extra fuel might work, and provide space for other outside gear you’d rather not carry inside the vehicle.
I love love LOVE that they ditched propane! Single fuel source is where it’s at! Wabasto heaters work great and are super quiet.
I’m actually not a fan of the bed vs the one on the concept. Extra motors that could break (although I’m sure they will be fine), but more than that is that I can’t sleep when the bed is raised as the top and bottom of the bed are at the lowest level. Keeping the bikes inside the van was always top priority for me, but it doesn’t look like the bed is tall enough to store the bikes in the down position.
Everything else looks fine to me. Price is a bit higher than I thought it would be, but the US B market is expensive 🙁 You can get a Brand new Van in Europe for around 55k USD, I have no idea why in the US the price is double.
Yeah, we were frankly confused by some of the prices we saw in Europe.
But to your point about the bed: Yeah, I think the bed at its lowest would be too low for bikes. But, I think you could make some extra tall cushions (or spacers that you could put the existing cushions on top of) for those spaces at the head and foot of the bed and that might solve the problem. That would be my first attempt at solving that problem, anyway.
Is the ceiling lighting dimmable?
I do not believe so.
Lichtsinn RV, whom I also asked, said it was dimmable. I assume they either already knew or went inside a unit they have on hand to verify. Regarding the lighting . . . Would you say the LED strip lighting on the ceiling is as white as the LED puck lighting, or a little more yellow (as I noticed in the Paseo when it was first introduced)? Hard to tell from the video. Thanks for letting me (us) pester you with all these questions.
I can neither confirm nor deny the LED lights being dimmable.
I suspect, if they are, that they are only two-stage dimmable, either low or high, as I did not see a rotary or slider switch anywhere in the coach.
I would also suspect, but cannot confirm, that they use the same supplier for all of the LED tube lighting. So the color is probably similar across the models.
Great review of a very interesting coach! It has been very exciting to watch the evolution of power systems over the past 5 years. I started RV camping when interior lights were propane globes and the “refrigerators” used big blocks of ice.
Looking forward to seeing this rig live at the Pomona Show, hope we run into you two there.
Andy & Kim
If you’re at Pomona the first weekend, we should be there.
Always fun to see you. (And we think you’ll like the Revel.)
Hope you can make it!
Would like to have the Revel here in Europe. Any chance you have a process for shipping overseas? Seems like quality is coming together with style. Europe and US. Unfortunately europe has massive deficits when it comes to style and taste.
Thanks for any info friends.
I really don’t know what the process would be for getting a Revel over in Europe.
Usually we hear that Europe has better style in RVs than North America. It’s interesting to hear the opposite from a European reader.
You should comment more often, Mark! The discussion would be interesting!
Great video to show all the new features – much better than the ‘live’ event with all that extra jive talk, IMHO…
I believe Russ mentioned there is a spare under the rear of the chassis…
To bad you didn’t remove the shelves to demonstrate the actual function of the shower…I.E. how cramped would it be..?
Love this rig… great stealth MoHo and so easy to get around town as well as the outback… Well done Winnebago..!
Yes, there is a spare and we’ve updated the post with that info. Normally I don’t much pay attention to a spare, but on this vehicle… it’s needed.
Good point on the shower. It seemed pretty large, but we didn’t test it out. Next time we see one, we will!
This looks almost perfect but I wish they had an option for a safe 2nd row seatbelt / seats for kids. It’s a deal breaker for me. Bummed.
Car seats not an option? Won’t some of those work with just lap belts?
James,
I loved the review! Thanks for taking the time to do an in depth, under the skin review.
Overall, it’s a concept I’ve been waiting to see. It’s a great gear hauler for a couple of weeks in the bush but I can’t see that it has the storage one would need for full-timing. I’m hoping Winnebago at least thinks about translating this into the longer Sprinter with the four wheel drive system.
Hymercar of Germany bought out RoadTrek and promised to bring their excellent Grand Canyon S 4×4 to the US. Sadly, that hasn’t materialized.
You prophesied a year ago that Winnebago would beat Hymercar to the market and you were right! Great call! Now, what are the tea leaves showing for a longer 4×4 from Winnebago. No, it wouldn’t be a rock crawler but it would allow for well provisioned long stays in the BLM Bush.
Thanks again!
Bill
I’m not aware of any plans for a longer version of the Revel. If it’s just the 4×4 you’re after, there are 4×4 versions of the ERA lineup available today!
James,
Thank you so much. I’ll have a look.
Best regards,
Bill
I also want to say thanks for putting this together. It really helped me. I’ve been getting frustrated by and uninformed sales person that I’ve been consulting with. What I like best about this model is the flexibility it provides for use of space in the back. That really sets it apart. That wide-open space could be configured in so many different ways depending on what type of trip you’re going on. I also like that it has some protection against freezeups in the winter. But I would like to know a practical concern which is what is the lowest temperature that would still be safe if the plumbing isn’t winterized. I’m thinking of lines in the unheated spaces like those shower valves in the back. Also I am wondering if the solar is maxed out at 200 W. Other questions I have are hard to answer. Is it unwise to buy something like this in its first model year? Should we wait for the redesigned Sprinter chassis that will be coming in 1-2 years? Life is too short and I want to avoid analysis paralysis. So I probably will take the plunge.
Hey thanks! It makes our day to hear that we’ve helped out.
As to your question on the lowest tolerable winter temperatures… we just don’t know. It hasn’t been around through a winter yet. I’m hoping we can snag one for a winter time test. I’d love to put it head-to-head with Lance in a freeze-off or something. That would be awesome! But like I said – no info available yet.
As for “first model year” vs. waiting… I always advise people to go for it. (and no, we don’t get any commission, lol) There will always be a next year’s model. I think it’s better to get out there and start doing whatever it is that you love than wait for that perfect RV.
Hope to see you out there on the road some day soon!
I love it! I live in the southwest and often camp in the desert, but I would never consider an A/C due to the necessity of a generator. It always amazes me that so many people go camping only to sit inside their RV with the A/C on. I want that nice big fan so I can smell and hear the outdoors (not generator noise and exhaust). Thanks for the info on this remarkable vehicle.
No problem! We were happy to have Chris as our guide!
Thanks for taking the time to put this video together. I have a few questions for you or others:
My wife and I are 40-something boondockers, and we love to explore BLM roads, fire roads, etc. We’re trying to decide between an Agile 4×4 and the Revel – – any opinions about which vehicle would fare better on those kinds of rutted backroads?
Care to offer a comparison to a Sprinter-based Sportsmobile?
Unlike many others, we would use the cooktop at least twice per day, and wish that it had a 2nd induction ‘burner’. 2-burner induction tops exceed the 2000 watt capabilities of the Revel’s inverter – – any idea if the inverter could be swapped out (after-market) to a larger unit, or would that cascade problems to the electrical system?
I haven’t seen a 4×4 Agile, so I can’t offer any opinion there. But – if you got that second alternator package, I would be concerned about protecting that alternator when going off road.
I would have no concerns like that with the Revel.
As to replacing the inverter: Yes, like anything, it *could* be done, given enough time and money. The problem you would get into is that the wiring is sized for the inverter it supports. If you wanted to replace the 2000 watt inverter with a 3000 watt model – you would have to rip out the wiring between the inverter and the battery and replace it with a larger gauge. Maybe even replace the wiring between the inverter and the 120v circuit breaker panel. I’m not saying it couldn’t happen, but it would be more complicated than just uninstalling the existing inverter and dropping a new one in its place.
Does the cabinet over the sink have slide-out shelving like the prototype?
Actually, no.
There is a clip of it that didn’t make the final video that shows the inside of that cabinet. It’s just a big empty space.
James, handy fellow that you are, how would you secure that ladder from theft?
I can’t decide if I would or not.
Any theft prevention would only inconvenience me as well. And the ladder is only any good to someone else with a Winnebago roof rack. You couldn’t even set it on the ground properly and use it without a van!
If I did decide to secure the ladder, it’s just 1/4-20 threading. So I would just get some kind of security bolt and use that instead of the handwheel.
Thanks James for the excellent and thorough review. Props to Winnebago. Such a cool, versatile vehicle. A bargain (and better equipped) when compared to Sportsmobile, Outside Van, etc. Do you know the height of the underbed area when the bed meets the side cushions? Doesn’t seem tall enough to sleep over bikes. And do you foresee bikes having to be stored crosswise? Any idea how deep that area is from front to back?
Thanks,
Shawn
With the front wheel off, I believe you could store bikes lengthwise instead of cross-coach.
If Winnebago dropped one of these off in my driveway tomorrow (hint, hint…), I would rig up some kind of fork mount track that could be hooked into those tie down rings. That way, I could remove it when we weren’t traveling with bikes. (That’s almost never, but it does happen sometimes…)
As to the height of the bed, I think you would want to stop the bed short of “full down”. The exact height would differ for everyone depending on their bikes. For us, the magic number is one meter high.
James, I was the one at the Pomona show with the tape measure, trying to see if I can store my bikes lengthwise and NO, the bed width is too narrow, I was hoping to store 4 bikes inside and that won’t happen, they will have to be stored crosswise ☹️, sorry I did not write down the height under the bed when it was in the low position, it just wouldn’t work for my bikes, even with the front wheels removed.
James,
Will the roof AC run off of the alternator with the engine running or is it strictly limited to shore power? Also no mention of a spare tire, is there one?
At this price the Roadtrek SS Agile with 4X4 and voltsart might be a better option for me. Kudos to Winnebego for noticing the market and jumping in.
Love your video’s, thanks and keep them coming. Chris.
AC will only run off of shore power. I did not see a spare tire, but I wasn’t looking for one. That’s a good question, and for this kind of vehicle, the spare makes sense.
I think the Revel offers a lot that the Roadtrek you mention doesn’t. Insulation. Full length running boards. Flares. Heated tanks (with diesel). Double pane windows.
Whether or not that one will work for you depends on what you intend to do with it. For any winter camping, I’d go with the Revel!
Agreed James, it’s all about the intended use.
If the Revel had AC that ran without shore power using an under hood generator and something similar to voltstart, it would be Goldilocks arriving on a pink unicorn with ice cold beer and carne asada tacos for me. That and a spare tire.
Living in the desert southwest those two items are crucial to me.
Understood.
But now I want tacos.
James,
Since other folks have compared the SS Agile from Roadtrek here are some details. 4X4 option with full body paint, outback package making it full electric
nets an MSRP of $157,048. Basic white 4X4 with the weekender package using propane for heat and stove only nets an MSRP of $145,224. Kind of brief I know.
Package details:
Outback $17,459:
EcoTrek™ 400, 300W solar panel, underhood generator, diesel with Alde heat and hot water system, VoltStart, induction stove, convenient screen door package, 24″ LED TV.
Weekender, $9,295:
200W solar panel, underhood generator with two additional 6V AGM batteries, VoltStart, convenient screen door package, 24″ LED TV
Both packages will run the AC off the inverter and automatically start the engine when the batteries reach a certain state of discharge. Coach AC will also run while traveling, pretty sure this is true for the base model as well.
If Winnebago offers something akin to the weekender package for the Revel, I’m all over it.
Link:
http://www.roadtrek.com/build-your-own/?ss-agile
Don’t mean to hijack, looks like a lot of people have the same questions so I thought I’d post an update.
Thanks for the info.
There’s more to the picture though. For instance, as I learn more about it, the insulation on the Revel is something that’s not available on a Roadtrek at any price.
Straightforward rig with flexible space. I particularly like the induction cooktop and compressor-driven fridge/freezer. Works for me. Wish Winnebago included the collision avoidance, lane-keeping and other OEM safety gear on this (versus none at all or the Mobile Eye aftermarket product). I know some folks will use it off-road, but others (like me) won’t so much and everyone has to travel the main roads too. Did you and Stef find the cassette toilet worked better while in Europe than in your original demo of it? It seems the right chemicals should help. I’ve used porta potties that were almost odor free, even after a lot of use, when plenty of blue biocide was used. Thanks for an informative and entertaining review.
Glad you liked the review, Rick!
The cassette was better in Europe with dedicated chemical toilet dumping stations and using (literally) four times the recommended amount of chemical.
Still not our favorite, but better than our first experience.
Why doesn’t someone establish a cassette exchange like we have with propane tanks?
Not enough people using them to make it worthwhile I suspect.
Thanks James and Stef for another great walk-through and for geeking out on the important stuff. Looks like a great, first gen build, and can’t wait to get a hold of one to put it through it’s paces as well. Regarding the AC (and unlimited 110 volt power for that matter), is it not possible to have a secondary alternator giving enough juice to (3) AGM’s to power the AC? Have seen on other forums that Mercedes emissions/warranty may not work well with this type of arrangement, but I’m not sure of the validity or science behind it.
A few things that I really like:
– big gear closet
– east-west sleeping with the bumpouts
– ground clearance
– the insulated awning windows
– the bathroom/gear closet (but would be SUPER cool if selectable heat ducting was at bottom of bathroom floor to turn whole closet into a drying booth by engaging roof vent fan)
A few things that bother me:
– lack of 3-point belts on the bench (a LOT of us have kids and would prefer)
– the sink pump
– the motorized awning with wind sensor (likely the first thing to break)
– MSRP seems a bit high, but curious what the “actual” cost will be (and like Allen said above, a ‘factory-direct’ option is long overdue)
Overall, looks to be a nice start to a growing sub-class in the RV industry.
Thanks again for keeping up with, and pushing the B-Class segment into new innovations and territories.
To answer the alternator question: Yes, second alternators are indeed possible. We have one on our own RV, Lance, and it provides ample power when the engine is running.
I agree with you on the awning. I don’t know why we’re forced to carry these things, and would love to see an “awning delete” option.
But, unlike you, I kinda like the sink pump! Yeah, it’s loud, but we’ve had two macerator pumps on our Travato for two years now and they’ve never given us any problems.
Thanks for chiming in!
There is no reason that you can’t just plug an extension cord with an adaptor into the ac outlet and then plug that into the shore power which would run the roof ac as long as the engine was running. If would work with it off as well, but Jim would know better how long the batteries would last. They wouldn’t last long. It may need a bigger alternator to run down the highway this way for long periods, but that is a simple upgrade you could do yourself or make part of the purchase agreement. However a hitchmounted junk rack w a small generator would work all the time, and if you went diesel could be plumbed right to the van fuel system with a remote electric start even if you wanted one.
The amp ratings of the plugs might prevent you from running the air properly. The plugs are likely 15 amps, and the AC requires more – especially to start. It would be a safer thing to upgrade the wiring and add the air conditioner circuit to the ones that are run by the inverter. Of course, then you would have to upgrade the cabling from the batteries to the inverter… etc. etc. etc. But yes, once you did that, you could likely run the air for quite a while if the engine were running. (You might also want to check the wiring from the alternator to the house electrical system if you did that, come to think of it.)
Ok, so you mentioned someone could plug in their “Honda 2000” generator and have air conditioning, and y’all just kinda glazed by that. WILL a Honda 2000 run that A/C? I have tried to get the answer to that question as the specs are VERY close – has anyone actually TRIED it yet? And then of course, the next question is, is that the same A/C United have in our Travatos? (Well, MOST of us have in our Travatos…)
The coach just went on sale last week, so I doubt anyone has tried it yet. 😉
The AC unit did indeed look like a Mach 10. It has a fairly moderate power consumption.
I am pretty confident a Honda 2000 would *run* it. The only question in my mind is would it *start* it.
That’s probably more a question for Honda and their specs on transient overloads.
Don’t forget, this unit also has 2000 watts of inverter available. I don’t know if that model of Magnum offers load support, but if it did, then that would allow the extra capacity needed to start.
Thanks James! Loving the Revel. Is there any reason why no lithium? Was it a price point decision to keep it under the Era?
I expect a couple of reasons.
First – Lithium batteries need to be kept warm to charge. The Revel is a smaller motorhome, so they didn’t want to take up room inside. Underneath would work, but the batteries would need to be heated. Extra cost and extra fuss.
Second – Knowing Winnebago, I would expect them to come up with a complete solution to the lithium chemistry, and not to have them piecemeal lithium batteries in one coach, and then later come up with a charging solution, and then maybe later another alternator, etc. etc. etc. When they finally do produce a lithium powered coach, expect it to be a complete system, and not just batteries.
I love it! Glad they put the external hatch on the cassette toilet. I used this system in Europe; not a fun task to empty, but it’s way better to do it from the outside and it’s not so bad once you get the hang of it. Also really impressed with the diesel heat appliance and the ‘multi-use’ concept for the bathroom. Good changes from the concept vehicle! Would have liked to see the lithium battery, but understand the challenges.
The $135K sticker is a big pill to swallow.. Wish they had some sort of ‘factory direct’ pricing scheme since I’m personally not interested in the service or the scene at my local Winnebago dealer. My ‘well loved’ Winnebago Eurovan Camper is long in the tooth and I’ve grown to trust and value the Winnebago brand.
I know they are being more choosy as to which dealers can deal the Revel. But they are still going to be sold through dealers.
Gee, now that I look into their dealer locator I see your point about being choosy about their dealers. I live in Central Oregon where it seems like there are a gazillion companies making and selling cool Sprinter van variations yet I have to drive to either Seattle or Sacramento just to check out the Revel?? Cmon Winnebago, what are you thinking?
To my point about not liking the dealer scene, our local Winnebago dealer feels like it’s either catering to the senior citizen RV buyer or the toy hauler crowd. I had to go to Portland to check out a Travato. Even there, the sales guy reminded me a lot of the type of person I would encounter on a used car lot. He didn’t know anything about the product.
Perhaps you should start some kind of on-line dealership? If I’m going to have to pay a fat juicy commission anyway I would rather see it going to someone like you who actually provides a valuable service. Ok, end of my rant..
That makes two super-cool business ideas this month from Fit RV readers!
I don’t know if Winnebago is legally able to have an online-only dealership, but it’s worth asking.
(Dealership laws and contracts can get pretty sticky, pretty quickly…)
James, I saw you flinch at the mention of the cassette toilet :). And I know you were biting your tongue to resist “Why no lithium batteries?” You probably know how to do the calculations, how many hours of sunlight for 200 watts of solar to charge those three batteries? I wonder how well that heating system will work in truly cold weather with those lines running outside the van to heat the two holding tanks? Kind of an odd mix of old and new. Do the hard core off roaders really demand or want a power awning? Great concept but think I’ll pass for now at $135,000. Thanks for the tour.
I didn’t clarify if the tanks were heated before or after the lines went through the heat exchanges and water heater. I suppose it would matter quite a bit where the heated glycol went first.
My thought was that heating those tanks would really lower the gycol temp by the time it reaches the heating source and therefore the system might really struggle to get the gycol back up to the proper temp for the next loop. Maybe not a problem, hopefully designed to meet those requirements.
Yeah, I get it.
But I think it depends on which way they routed the glycol lines. If they went from the burner FIRST inside to the heater and hot water, and THEN went outside to the tanks… Well, at that point, you’d be heating the tanks with leftover heat, and it wouldn’t have any effect on the temperatures inside. Right? Or am I missing something?
OK. I just confirmed with Winnebago. The glycol lines run FIRST to the coach heat exchangers. THEN to heat the tanks with whatever heat is left over.
That’s exactly the way I would have done it, and it makes the most sense.
The tanks only need to be kept at 33 degrees to keep from freezing up, so residual heat should be more than sufficient.
The concept is nice and well built. I like the bed.
The table altough looks kinda flimsy and I really dont like those rounded edges with the cheap plasticky edges
Well, if you’re thinking of a “regular” RV like our Travato, then yes, the table is smaller and moves more. But the crowd this rig is aiming at are probably the type that don’t mind holding their cereal bowls in their hands while they eat. 🙂
Concerning the little fold up table. Some Revel owners (you know people and their mods!) are taking one of the shelves out of the Revel’s bathroom/shower and temporarily (via parts found at Lowes/HD) affixing it to the fold up table increasing its size by what looks like 50%.
The attachment/detachment process takes at most 2 min’s.
When not being used this way or in the shower it is stored behind the bench seat backrest 🙂